Retraining Dollie

[zhiaral]

Are there other links to those videos? All I get are advertisements by 'ARAlifestyle'.

[gotkiger]

ah ha I did my knot wrong... no wonder it would slide a little. I face the tail back towards the neck but go up instead of down. I will fix that.

I will be gone this weekend (my daughters first birthday) but I will be back out working Dollie with what i have seen on Monday. I will try to get a new video then with the first attempts of the new information Monday morning. Pre-warning: that video will be long and boring. I wont have a camera man most likely so it will be fixed onto the back of my truck and on while I catch and do everything I want to do. I also don't know how to edit besides trimming the end or beginning and putting music instead of the audio.

[Michelle Clarke]

You should be able to see the video on this page itself. I will add direct links also when I post:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ybgQibZBeU&feature=g-upl

www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQG6KgAvf4o&feature=g-upl

[DianneC]

Nice clear instruction!

[fantasykiger]

I agree, very nice clear instruction that is easy to follow and understand. Nice video as well, that is clear and easy to see

[zhiaral]

I have no idea why I can't see them here on the forum... but the links work perfectly for me. Very well done! I particularly like the haltering, since I've never used a rope halter.

[gotkiger]

I got a basic ground work video taken this evening, but of course it is taking forever to load so I will attach the link tomorrow.

I haven't done ground work with Dollie in about 4 or 5 months so shame on me, but I figure it will help everyone to see her and me not doing the best at it. Lots of mistakes, lots of things to work on and critique.

I worked with her a little before I did the video so she was thinking "oh goody I'm done!!!" nope WRONG, lol. So she was giving me some attitude for that. She was also pissed at me because I gave her an allergy shot a little before I worked with her. and she could smell and see her dinner grain bucket in the back of the truck.

Changes from last video:
Halter knotted correctly
Stirrups lengthened one notch
spurs gone
only halter and lead rope on her face.

[Michelle Clarke]

Okay, I'll look at the video, then when I upload the first groundwork one, I can tailor it more to what you need...

[zhiaral]

I got a soft rope halter for Dusk, took the 10-foot lead it came with off and replaced it with my 12-foot lead (after taking the snap off mine). I only got it today, but Dusk and I both already seem to like it much better. Other than her repeated efforts to eat it...

[gotkiger]

Better late than never. Here is my latest video. It is very bad. This is me working Dollie for the first time doing ground work in about 5 months or so. Granted I don't know much of what anyone would want to see but here is a start.

I lowered my stirrups one notch, lost the spurs, and only have the halter on her face. I am using my 12 foot lead but left the clip on (more like I forgot to take it off, but it will be coming off tomorrow).

youtu.be/rDFrHPi-6OE

What I notice by watching it that needs work (in my opinion)
- I seem to be moving rather fast. When I am out there it doesnt seem like I am going that fast.
- at 40 seconds I let her cross behind me and didnt get her back on my right
- at 58 seconds she stops on top of me... it almost looks like I was going to make her back up but she started scratching and i said forget it.
- at 1:20 her ears are pinned
-1:35 im not sure what happened
-2:52 I get in front of her but get her going again
-3:02 I attempt to change direction but she refuses
-3:32 I cant decide which way to ask her to back
-3:41 She doesnt follow
-4:00 We stop, I turn to reaproach her and she backs. I stop and deliberately change my focus to the rope and try again
-5:12 i squeeze with no responce


Baby is crying so there my self critique stops
-

[Michelle Clarke]

Thanks for uploading this - gives me a good idea for starting points. I like the way you put the halter on and got it adjusted well.

The first thing that pops out at me is yes, you are walking fast and have lots of energy through the workout - Dollie does not! One of the concepts you will be working on is "match your energy". When you have lots of energy, she needs to bring hers up to match, when you slow down, she needs to follow suit. Remember that horses live and die off of reading body language and responding. The fact that she ignores you and even gets a bit pissy about it, shows you what she thinks of that!

Letting her stop to itch herself would not normally be an issue; except in her case, at that moment - she is taking over and buying time off of working. I would have pushed her. She needed to earn that itch at that point. I am looking at her whole overall demeanor, not just that one act. Had she come out not trying to already move your feet by walking directly behind you and moving off to the left, I would have thought - no big deal. She also paid no attention to you while you where getting into position and then surprise...ears back voicing her opinion even further - just in case you did not get it the first time!!! If that were my horses and I was standing out playing with the rope, they would be on full alert going "something is about to happen...".

I am going to shoot a video on working on leading today also. When you put that halter on, it is go time. The horse should already be engaged as far as paying attention and getting ready for a workout. The way they walk over to the workout area already tells you what kind of day it is going to be and you need to be planning what is going to happen next.

At the ear pin point, she needed a whack. Not for the ears, for stopping her feet after she was asked to move and you were still moving. Here is one of the skeletons we are going to follow in order of what we address: feet, softness then attitude. At first, all we care about is what her feet are doing and not worrying too much about how soft she is (physically or mentally) and we surely don't care about her attitude towards it. I will also say, there are only two times I ever hit a horse - if they don't move and then if they move over me. Moving their feet is the number one sign letting you know if they respect you or not.

I would have given her a whack on her shoulder to get her moving again. You are doing a whole lot of dancing, waving about and kissing just to get a piss poor trot out of her. I do like your energy when she is trotting as far as the speed of your feet and I do like your position in relation to her - energy at her shoulder to keep her moving. I also like that you are walking in a circle along with her. This helps teach the concept of going together, instead of you just standing in the center with no or low energy and she learns to have more than you. Two things to think about - your lead hand (left) is always up and out, kind of begging her to keep going. You need to put it back in neutral once she is moving because it is her responsibility not only to stay going but to match your body energy - not being lead out front and driven in the back just to keep going. It is a form of nagging - not that she doesn't deserve it at this point but it will cause her attitude to be sour. Right now the release is leaving her alone; even if it is just by you going into neutral with your body.

When you stop to get her to stop, I'd like you to really relax and stay put for a second. Let your shoulders drop, relax your midsection, thingy a leg even and let your breath out.

Realize that your hand being that high is not helping with her high headedness. Your hand needs to always be about waist height or lower, even when you lead out to send. Bringing your hand up toward their eyes causes the head to go up and the neck to go to the outside. I want you to picture something. If you are standing in front of your horse, facing them and they are squarely facing you and you lift your left arm straight out and to the left - what do you think it naturally causes a horse to do? Pretend you are the horse, not knowing anything and your human stands in front of you like that - which way would you naturally want to go???

Not to the left! The human is blocking that direction. They naturally back up and the if energy is involved, they go right - away from pressure. So anyone reading out there that does the Parelli point to get their horse to go that way - think about it! Even if you have taught them to go through your pressure (can't be good for things later on...), you will send them out stiff and braced to the outside.

Okay...off for chores but will be back at lunch to finish your video and start uploading mine.

Sarah, we've got a great starting place. You've got some good things going on, we just need to get you a program going to fix all the little things up that add up to big things later on, especially in the saddle.

[Michelle Clarke]

Finishing off watching your video...when you are walking with your horse in a circle, your weight needs to be on the foot closer to the horse. If your weight is on your lead foot, your energy is in front of the horse, therefore blocking. I like when you changed directions the second time (@ 3:00), you stepped towards her. I would have kept stepping toward her and let my rope run right into her shoulder.

We'll address the backing up at another time but when she did not follow you off, I would have pushed her forward instead of backing her up again. Keep the subject in front of her - don't change it up. Also, I would have kept the same pressure on the rope at that point. She got a release when you asked her for forward, then took the time to readjust your rope, let it get slack, then asked her to back again. She got to stop her feet plus get a loose rope. Not much of a consequence.

The other thing there is that you pulled. Never ever ever never never never never ever ever ever never never ever ever ever ever never never e v e r pull on your horse. Firstly, they learn to brace very quickly and you don't really accomplish anything. Second (well, maybe first) they are stronger and you just reminded her of it. Horses always come off of their own pressure. If a horse pulls on you, you just hold and drive them until they come off it; that is a big difference if you pull on them and they brace up. You could have kept the same pressure and walked to the side to put her off balance and make her take one step - then release and start over.

You can always ask again. Remember that. You can always ask agian.

When you stop and walk toward her, she stepped back and you stopped again. She basically just got you to stop your feet and allow her to evade you. I would have kept walking toward her and put my hands on her until she stopped OR I would have sent her back forward and asked again. Then you actually petted her for the good job of training you...

I REALLY like how you set her up for mounting and the saddle did not slip so much when you mounted. Did it feel weird to do it that way? If you do this everytime you mount up, she will begin to set herself up and you won't have to worry about it anymore. One of the points of training is to set every step up correctly so you can build on it. Standing still for mounting and dismounting is the basis for a lot of things including a square and balanced stop. This is the first introduction to teaching your horse to pay attention to your weight and make their own adjustment. It is also the first introduction to the rider to pay attention to their own weight and balance themselves along with the horse.

I like how you took your time after you got on - they really need to learn to wait until asked to move off, no matter how long it takes. She is learning how to pay attention to you on a much better level instead of just taking over or waiting for a higher level of reinforcement to get her to do or not to do something. Dismounting was really good too. We'll talk about riding tomorrow....I'd like you to ride only with one rein - not tying it up.

Okay, I'm going to upload those vidoes. Nice job Sarah! You made some good changes quickly.

[Michelle Clarke]

Zhiaral, glad you got the longer rope and took the snap off...and you both appreciated it!! When you watch Sarah work with the 12' rope she has, you can see quite a few times that if she had a few more feet, she would be more effective - makes a big difference!

[Michelle Clarke]

The Leading Video is uploading now...one thing I want to mention is that training is not a finished product. Training is sometimes not pretty and looks nothing like where the end result will be. A horse needs time to develop each of their skills as they progress, at their own pace and own style. We need to be patient and help that horse along at each step.

The first part shows Chilli, being taken into the roundpen for a riding session. I wanted to show this because I like the way she is paying attention to Callie, gives her space and follows nicely; keeping the lead rope slack and staying at a respectful distance. This shows a horse that is engaged and her mind is ready for the lesson of the day.

The horse used in the bulk of the video is Payton. She is a three year old filly I just bought for Taiwan. She has had groundwork done for the past year or so by her owner who takes classes with my husband, Eric, with another young horse she has. Payton has no respect for women - she is pretty spoiled and has lots of opinions about being told what to do. She does not engage in the lessons and her whole body language states "this just stinks!" She was not prepared for a job during her lazy life and she shows it. This will change over the next few months as her training progresses and she learns a work ethic.

We've had about seven inches of rain over the past five days, so she is a little sore on the rocks. The grass is still pretty wet and I did not want her to slip - so I picked the lesser of two evils I suppose.

Okay...waiting for the upload to finish but don't know if I'll get back to the computer until late tonight.

[gotkiger]

Since I started working with Dollie (October 2008) the one thing I have noticed about her is that she is lazy. She only wants to put forth enough effort to get by. That is one thing I will admit I don't know how to change about her. Correction, If I introduce a whip then she steps up a little but still only if i get after her with it, and yes I have cracked it on her rump before to try to get her to know I mean business but it hasn't worked.

I take to blame for letting her stop and itch herself. I felt really bad for her at that point because she was and still is being eaten alive by the flies here and she reacts a lot to it. She got her allergy shot Monday afternoon which should help so my sympathy for that is now gone.

When she pinned her ears I am not sure I saw it until I watched the video, if i had she would have been whacked pretty good. One thing that has been told to me before is that she doesn't respect me and move out of my way. She expect me to move out of her way. This is the first time i have sat down and watched how we move together and what we do, and it is surprising. I didn't think I moved out of her way or at least that much... I was wrong. Big mean Sara who means business is coming out and being head bimbo of the barn now.

I worked with a trainer here with Dollie twice and he told me to put my hand out level with my shoulder and hold it there. It is a huge relief to know that that is going away. To be honest I never understood it. I always held my hand about a foot in front of my belly button while lunging, maybe off to the side a little but always between my two sides.

Me pulling her. Hehe... that goes to show how little I was taught as a child about working with horses, and the horse I learned to work with. It was only recently that I learned not to pull but to hold pressure and move off to the side and make them take that step. I still forget but I am trying to get better about that.

I didn't even catch me rewarding her for bad behavior. I guess I am just a softy and cant keep my hands off of her. I will do my best next time to not do that. I have helped someone else who did that and they wondered why the horse kept doing what they didn't want them to do. As I was watching them I saw them pet the horse after doing the bad behavior and I told them what they did. lol oops, Looks like I need to pay more attention to what I am doing as a natural response to being near her.

Mounting was a little awkward but not bad. I can see why a step is helpful and will probably use my bucket next time unless I can build a step by then.

I tried to ride her with one rein but as you could probably guess she didn't listen. Instead, she went straight for the fence to tell me she was done, ehhhh wrong. She got in trouble after that so i got off and back on but tied the rope to get her back over to where I wanted her once she walked off. I kind of doubt she ever learned any one rein stuff.

I grew up in the city and around a lot of people who would call the cops on you if you lifted a finger to discipline your animals. So i am a little reserved in showing my discipline during training or ride. Also with being on the dairy we have PETA people randomly hanging around trying to get someone in trouble.