Grinding Flax/other supps

[Michelle Clarke]

After recently attending a holistic nurtition seminar for horses, one of the things we learned about is how good flax is for your horses. However, fed whole, it passes through. That I knew, so we grind it every morning.

This is wrong too. Not only does grinding create heat, which denatures usable nutrients, but it creates a magnetic charge which alters the composition.

The best way to feed flax is to soak it. I bought a wide-mouth sealed container and soak what I need for the morning overnight and for the night during the whole day. I have found that for whatever amount of flax I put in, I put double the water, maybe a little more. It turns into a gooy mess that mixes easily with any feed and also helps supplements stick real well.

It is only good for 24 hours after being soaked and when it is warm outside, it needs to be done in the fridge. A cup twice per day was recommended for most situations and this is measured by volume AFTER the soaking.

I thought it was going to be a pain, but it is actually easier than the grinding I was doing, plus the horses eat it all now instead of some of them leaving it on the bottom of the bowl or pushing it out. I just take my measuring cup, dip it in, dump and mix - done!

[pepper]

I started feeding flax to Amigo 4 years ago to help with his allergies & experimented with all methods.I found that even soaking the seeds didn't stop most of them from passing through undigested..proven by the number of flax sprouts in my horse's poop!
I grind a couple of day's worth at a time in a small coffe grinder ,just enough to crack the hull & notice no heat .In the summer I store it in my fridge but in winter,it's cold enough to keep out in the barn.Again,only 2 or 3 days (a cup per horse) at a time.Both horses are dappled & shiney & even their winter coats are soft & glossy.
Actually the "best way" would probably be coldpressed flax oil but that's WAYYYY too expensive for me!

[desperatehorsewife]

So you guys are seeing the flax come through undigested?

I've heard a few folks who insist that BOSS isn't digested, but I've never seen it come through so I'm sure it is. If you're seeing the flax, then I'd venture to guess we'd be seeing the sunflowers as well.

[pepper]

What is BOSS? If it contains un-shelled sunflower seeds then I'd look forward to a lovely display of flowers in your pasture this summer!The problem with these seeds is the tough husk is made to protect it till it germinates & even the best equine chewer won't crush all of them so they just pass on through.The smaller the seeds the more that get by.

[Michelle Clarke]

If you have soaked flax or oats coming through undigested, this only means the horses stomach is not processing them because it is not healthy. The stomaches job is to make everything that comes in to liquid so it can be absorbed by the hind gut. Vaccinations, deworming, and medications (bute, anitbiotics, etc) kill EVERYTHING in the gut, not just the bad stuff. So if you are not putting the enzymes back in then they deplete and the stomach can no longer work properly. Then you start to get stuff back in the hind gut which leads to more issues like malabsorption, leaky gut, water retention...

We have 20 horses on soaked flax and I have yet to see it in the manure, so there must be some reason for it!

[desperatehorsewife]

Black Oil Sunflower Seeds, yes. I'm seeing nothing in the manure and haven't heard of anyone sprouting flowers, lol! Then again, the birds may be coming along and eating it, eh? But I image they're getting digested well enough as most folks using them swear by them. I asked one of the vets at the clinic I use and he'd not heard of people using it for horses but said in the midwest they used them all the time in dairy feed. Great source of fiber and fat, I was told. My sheep love them, too.

[nrly]

so how do you get the enzymes back in the horse if that is the problem. Now the bran does not go hot even when wet, but if our pellets get wet they ago hot, so we use to give wet bran the pellets till we felt the hot, so now it is dry bran at all times.

[sonrisa98]

I feed my gelding Yea-Sacc. Its a yeast culture that supports the hindgut. The only problem with it is he don't like it and wastes it. The yea-sacc is also in the LMF feeds that I give all my horses. His hindgut has finally straightened out and no more diarrhea. YAY!!!!!!! I've fought with that for 2 yrs with him and in less then 2 weeks he actually had normal poo in his stall. I'm so relieved.

[pepper]

Sorry Michelle,you aren't gonna convince me that a horse's gut has a problem because it can't dissolve a seed husk that has been designed by nature to not "break down" in fact soaking the seeds may make them sprout sooner.You did say you just switched from grinding to soaking & it is winter....so maybe your garden will bloom in the warmer weather.Also,your horse-keeping maybe better than mine & all your poop gets picked up in a timely manner,so you wouldn't see the sprouted flax.By the way...they're quite pretty with a blue tiny flower.
The topic of how to feed flax has been extensivly covered on several sites and like I said,been working for my horses for 4 years & neither has any health issues,digestive or otherwise(except for Amigo's fly allergy which is not unique and under control.)
I actually was gonna reply to your post suggesting that rice bran was a good feed for overweight horses...I used that for a while also & it too must be kept cool or be treated to keep it from spoiling but I found the fat content really packed the weight on Amigo so stopped feeding it.
I like to keep feeding as simple as possible even though I have two horses who couldn't be more different,16hd,6 yr old ,1200lb Amigo(kiger) who's being trained for dressage & 14'2,900lb Ali(arab) who has 2000 +miles & 8 years of endurance racing and going strong at 15.Both are amazingly(& fortunately)" healthy as horses!"....and waiting out in the yard for a good brushing.

[Michelle Clarke]

The great thing about this board is we all have different experiences to share! It is always nice to pass along information.

Yes, the soaking is new to me and maybe I'll learn something - well, hopefully I'll learn something! I do know that soaking the seeds does allow nutrients and oil to make a gel with the water and puts it in a more "usable" form for the body to absorb.

The information here may be of interest to some:

www.kamanimalservices.com/

[Michelle Clarke]

After speaking with a nutritionalist, this is what I was told:

"Soaking the seeds activates the enzymes. Since all seeds have enzyme inhibitors, soaking removes them and the enzymes begin working. If you don't soak, the inhibitors wind up in your gut and the enzymes cannot do their job."

So, if you are using the flax for oil, then I would guess grinding does not make a difference (except getting rancid quickly and just because you can't smell it does not mean it's not bad). If you are wanting to use the flax for gut health and as an aide to helping breakdown foodstuffs, I would soak.

[citykid]

Michelle, did you have Gabriele Sutton down by you? If so, this is just way too weird.
I have 2 ladies at my barn that have horses close to 30 years old. Last year they introduced me to this nice lady from Canada who was helping them with nutrition; one of the horses had a founder eposode 8-10 years ago. This same friend used to babysit Dr. John Hanover when he was little. So, tonight when I saw them soaking flax seed the light bulb went off.... if true what a small world. They have been using "FinallY' feed very successfully.

[Michelle Clarke]

Yes, Gabrielle is the nice gal that came down. In fact, when Eric found out Dr. Hanover was on board, the program got instant respect from him! I can't say enough what great results we have had, and keep seeing more as time goes on. Desi is just a different horse - and Charro, he has not been this healthy and vibrant in YEARS! We did an ulcer treatment for him too and I think that just kicked it over the top. His back has come up and gotten strong once agian plus his stride completely changed from short and choppy to long and flowing as it was....seeing him transform makes me want to throw a saddle up there and start riding him again!