Iberian head profile?

[fantasykiger]

Just attempting to educate myself with those of you more familiar with spanish breeds, while browsing thru the Kiger Mustangs up for internet adoption I came across #8216 with a differant profile then the others.

Now would this convex profile be considered to be more Iberian or does this fellow just have a roman nose and bit of a parrot mouth..I tend to think he is just a tad tight lipped due to being driven into a chute for a photogragh.

[desperatehorsewife]

It's not a parrot mouth, as I've got other pics of him without that look. I also wondered about his profile and how it compared, though. He's different than the others, but it could just be a bend there just above the nostrils.

[Michelle Clarke]

Here are some Iberian type heads on Lusitanos:



The Iberian head is described as thus: a soft convex line that starts between the ears and goes down smoothly all the way to the nostrils.

A sub-convex appearance over the nasal bone with a flat forehead is draft.



If you notice on the above skull, the nasal bone is pretty much out on it's own without much support. This area of the nose can get easily damaged from banging into something, halters left on, rough handling with a halter/chain/bosal etc. This area can form calcium deposits very quickly in reaction to trauma, so can give the appearance as a roman or lump. I am not sure what the above skulls horse breed it is, but I have about a dozen skulls and they are mostly QH and Thoroughbred and that nasal bone is very flat.

[DianneC]

What is subcovex?

[desperatehorsewife]

Perhaps he's had a broken nose...

[MustangsInNC]

I adopted a Flanigan, NV, horse, and he had a huge bump on his nose. Not sure if it was from draft influence or if he had it broken as well.

[Michelle Clarke]

My understanding is that sub-convex is a slight rise above the vertical, where as convex is more of what you see in the two Lusitano mares up top.

[DianneC]

In the second picture it doesn't seem as sudden a bump. They were all so beaten up with scraped up heads in the original pictures. It may have been a kick that will go down or it may not. If you look at the pictures from 1996 in the Herd Management Plan that Jillian shared in the 1991 - 1996 time line (http://www.kigerhorse.org/96BLMManagementPlan.html) you will see several horses with smooth but slightly convex profiles. Fine muzzles were something mentioned often which are not normally seen with strongly convex profiles.

[fantasykiger]

So while the profile of the Kiger I originaly posted about is more convex then his herd mates, it is not what we would describe as a Iberian head, as other characteristics you would expect to find like a slightly dropped nose and heavier muzzle are not present. Am I right ?

[spanishsagegrullas]

Tiffany, for a Kiger it is a fine Iberian profile and head. Compare it to the grey mare above, and keep in mind that the mares have the mane and forelock shaved, and are in their summer coat. And, that this guy is a mature stud, and studs develop the "jowls" that the mares do not.

Iberian heads also do not have a heavy muzzle at all, not pony-like and squared, but somewhat refined and tapered.

I am also a bit worried about some people misinterpreting the 'flat between the eyes as draft' comment.

In most horses, you will have a somewhat flat forehead. Don't get too sophisticated. You don't have to put a ruler against their heads. If it generally forms an arch from poll to muzzle, its sub convex, or convex.

There are different interpretations of what subconvex is and what
convex is. Horses with a stronger outward-bent profile can be called convex.
There are no written, set-in-stone definitions.

If you see a typical Iberian head, you will learn to recognize it.

Diane P.
Spanish Sage Ranch

[fantasykiger]

OK thanks, for the clarification on the muzzle I seemed to just have things backwards there.

This is a head shot of my Clydesdale mare, as you notice there is no convex to her skull between her eyes. She is has a flat forehead and a roman nose with tapered muzzle. It is differant from the Iberian profile.

[desperatehorsewife]

Here's FC's profile. A little convex, perhaps? Interested to hear your opinions. No, she's not parrot mouthed (I don't think), she just does that when I'm working with her and she's deep in thought (thinking how she'd like me to go away! ;D)



That's my makeshift halter on her as we try to get her over her poll issue.