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Post by Michelle Clarke on Mar 9, 2012 7:50:50 GMT -5
Been hearing lately in my circle of holistic vets and friends, that it is beginning to seem that the West Nile vaccination is linked to starting COPD in some horses. I've got a lot more investigation to do but thought I would share now in case folks are getting ready for any spring vacs.
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Post by stormyranch on Mar 9, 2012 8:33:49 GMT -5
Will you be vacinating for west Nile?
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Post by Michelle Clarke on Mar 9, 2012 13:25:40 GMT -5
I have never vaccinated any horse for WN. I remember when it first came out, we lived in Chicago and had dead crows in our pastures daily. A horse down the street died from it, another had a bad reaction from the vaccine and died. At the time we had 45 horses - all different breeds/ages in for training. A few horses got a little down but no one got ill or contracted the disease to the point of visible signs. I was privy to a lot of information at the time and knew of many horses on big farms dying from the vaccine. They were using it only on a "conditional" release - it had not even finished testing. To my knowledge, it never was finished and is still not supposed to be used on pregnant mares or stallions or foals for that matter. Many farms I knew were having problems conceiving, foaling, stallion fertility, abortions and deformed foals being born. You may or may not want to read through this site but it is very informative and you can make a better choice based on your gut feeling. lost-foals-group.4t.com/ |
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Post by DianneC on Mar 9, 2012 23:55:02 GMT -5
Two of my mares lost their unborn foals with the "new" vaccine when it came out.
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Post by stormyranch on Mar 10, 2012 8:51:37 GMT -5
I never have vacinated either, I was just asking.
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Post by backacres on Mar 14, 2012 12:34:44 GMT -5
I'm new to the board but have been "lurking" for awhile. Thanks for posting this. I have 2 kigers geldings in CT. One had a slight cough last April for a couple weeks when we had tons of pollen around. We started wetting his hay and he was no longer coughing and had clear lung sounds according to the vet when he was vaccinated for WN, as well as rabies, tetanus, eastern and western encephalitis in May. I am sure that triggered something to go wrong with his immune system and he has been battling a respiratory problem ever since. It was a long saga, involving 5 different antibiotics for secondary bacterial pnuemonia, oral steroids for 7 months, and tons of diagnostic testing, but he is currently doing ok on an inhaler. The vets are not convinced this was triggered by allergy or virus, and my feeling has always been maybe it was a slight allergy that got pushed into a major immune reaction due to the vaccinations. Needless to say we will not be vaccinating this year! Please post any other information you come across, as I'd like to have some "back up" when I have the inevitable arguments with the vets over our decision!
Vikki :-)
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Post by DianneC on Mar 18, 2012 23:35:39 GMT -5
You simply say, no.
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Post by prizmbluekigers on Mar 19, 2012 15:48:23 GMT -5
Vets can be touchy when told their long standing values are not your values. I was slaughtered by a vet I called when Fit seemed to be colicky. She blasted me for not worming according to her schedule and when I said I did not veaccinate I thought she was going to report me for animal abuse.
I agree with Dianne. They are OUR horses and the buck stops with us, so decisions should be ours. This board and the collective experience found here area a part of my life that I depend on.
Sorry you had so much trouble after shots. One WN vaccination and the minor reaction were enough for me to halt shots. I will vaccinate for rabies of ot appears here as our area of Bend is full of wild and domestic animals. The wild ones roam through our properties, the deer eat out of our bird feeders and so on, plus we have cats and dogs,
Stand your ground, I did and found a vet that totally works with me and does not push shots at my animals.
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Post by kigerfan on Mar 19, 2012 16:56:25 GMT -5
I have long believed that we way over-vaccinate our animals. There have been research articles that show much of the live and killed virus vaccines stay within our animal's bodies long after the vaccinations and that they build up as we vaccinate more. They sit there dormant (or not so dormant) until our animals have a health issue that affects their immune systems. Once the system is affected, the viruses become active and cause other issues. This is especially true in older animals.
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Post by michelle77 on Mar 19, 2012 19:43:01 GMT -5
I had my Arab mare vaccinated for the west nile virus when it was first going around and the vets more or less scared you into it. After being vaccinated she stood under a tree with her hear to the ground for 3 days the vet came back out said it was most likely a reaction to the vaccine. She was never her same self again so needless to say that started my deep search into all vaccines and I had never vaccinated a horse again.
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Post by Michelle Clarke on Mar 19, 2012 20:58:46 GMT -5
When I bought my first QH mare, she was bred. The ranch she came from did no vaccinate - hell, I don't even think they dewormed because the older mare was 11 and never had a human hand on her...not to mention what came out of her once I did! Her filly was raised here, like the rest of my guys - no vaccinations, no antibiotics or western meds in her life. A good friend of mine bought her and consequently sold her a few years later - she had never been off our ranch.
The mare had a sore cheek one day - looked like a mesquite thorn maybe and I could not get my hands in far enough to see if it went through. Since this was not my horse anymore (or Lynns'...), I called the new owner and she had the vet out there in a hour. By the time the vet came, the mare was better - no thorn (must have come out on it's own, go figure). The vet gave the mare a huge shot of Penicillin, a shot of Banamine and a five day stint of Tucoprim (sulfer based antibiotic).
I swear, this mare was never the same. She began to show aggression in the pasture with horses she had grown up with and been with her whole five years of life; besides the fact for a couple weeks she acted like she was in a stupor. Her training went downhill, as she would zone out and get stubborn. I've never seen anything like this before.
I asked some of my horse vets if they had even seen aggression reactions or other stuff from antibiotics - they all said NO. I began asking small animal vets and the answer was YES; many from sulpher based ones.
I am not against antibiotics when needed, don't get me wrong. Personally, we just have not needed them in years - most things I can take care of other ways. Just like everything else, they need to be in check and people should be made aware of the side effects.
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Post by DianneC on Mar 24, 2012 11:34:09 GMT -5
One of our colts was purchased and kept at a barn where they vaccinated for everything. They almost lost him after being vaccinated for rabies, which we don't have here except rarely. I don't remember all his symptoms, but it was wild and took him three or four weeks to recover. Its the combination of three or four things at once that is especially bad. Even a cat we had had a reaction to a combined shot and got a tumor at the injection site that had to be removed.
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Post by stacy on Mar 24, 2012 22:27:09 GMT -5
Regarding the cat...cats get fibrosarcomas from any injection that causes inflammation. Anything from a vaccine to a steroid shot to a microchip. As far as I know, this syndrome is specific to cats and not reported with other species. (This from my small animal Vet husband.) It is not a vaccine problem, but a reaction to injections. I just didn't want this argument to sway horse people regarding vaccines. It isn't related.
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Post by DianneC on Mar 25, 2012 11:43:06 GMT -5
ah, OK. Good to know Stacy, thanks. I think that the times I will vaccinate are before weaning and before transport, but a limited coverage, not everything under the sun.
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Post by stacy on Mar 26, 2012 10:38:18 GMT -5
Yeah, I think I will do the same thing.
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